MARY LOUISE KELLY, HOST:
The actor Gillian Anderson likes to talk about sex, specifically about female pleasure. There's the fact that she plays a sex therapist on the Netflix hit, "Sex Education."
(SOUNDBITE OF TV SHOW, "SEX EDUCATION")
GILLIAN ANDERSON: (As Jean Milburn) Yeah, sexuality is fluid. Sex doesn't make us whole. And so how could you ever be broken?
KELLY: There's the fact that she showed up at the Golden Globes this year in a dress embroidered with dozens of vaginas - brand appropriate, as Anderson put it. Well, Gillian Anderson's latest project is collecting the sexual fantasies of women around the world. The result is the new book, "Want."
And I want to alert people that for these next seven minutes or so, we may get into explicit details as we talk this through. Gillian Anderson, welcome.
ANDERSON: A pleasure to be here.
KELLY: Before we get to why - why do this - let's do how. You invited women to submit their wildest, most intimate fantasies anonymously. How did this work?
ANDERSON: Well, there was a book that came out in '73 called, "My Secret Garden," which did a similar thing with women writing in in letter form to the author, Nancy Friday. And we were attempting to do something similar. And in order to collect anonymous letters, in this day and age, one needs to create a portal of sorts that can collect them so that the women who are submitting cannot be traced.
At the end of the day, we have absolutely, to the best of our ability, protected the women who have submitted. And so women from around the world - from, as we say, New Zealand to Nigeria, Romania to Russia - have submitted letters. And we have the most extraordinary collection of writings.
KELLY: Just to follow up on something you said. This was inspired, you said, originally because a book that came out in 1973, "My Secret Garden," had attempted something similar. If it's been done, why do it again? Do you think female fantasies have radically changed in those 50 years?
ANDERSON: Well, I think that's part of what we were wanting to see, is with so much that has changed, both in the degree to which we see sex daily from billboards to TV shows to magazine ads in a way that certainly didn't exist in the '70s, and the degree to which porn is a multibillion, if not, trillion-dollar industry, how might that be affecting the inner lives of women when they think about sex. Has anything changed? - was part of what I was curious about.
KELLY: And?
ANDERSON: It's interesting. I was surprised about how much tenderness women are interested in experiencing. There is a through line of women very much wanting to be seen and loved for who they are, which I'm not sure that entirely comes out in Nancy Friday's book. You know, there's a lot of entries about group sex. There's a lot of entries about BDSM. But I think at the end of the day, what stands out most for me is, still, even with how prevalent sex is in the modern world, how much we seem to struggle to ask for what it is that we want, both in bed and in our lives. And, you know, many women write about the fact that they would never share this with their partner, that they...
KELLY: Yes.
ANDERSON: ...I'm curious about that. You know, I'm not an expert...
KELLY: I was struck by that, too.
ANDERSON: Yeah.
KELLY: I was struck by that, too.
ANDERSON: Yeah. Yeah.
KELLY: There were letter after letter saying my partner can never know I think this way. And I - as I read, I thought, well, why? There's so much shame.
ANDERSON: Yeah. Yeah.
KELLY: There's so much guilt still caught up in...
ANDERSON: Yeah.
KELLY: ...All of this in liberal...
ANDERSON: I know.
KELLY: ...In 2024.
ANDERSON: I know. And if you ask me why this book? I would say that's why.
KELLY: Yeah.
ANDERSON: That's exactly why.
KELLY: So forgive me if I turn this on you...
ANDERSON: Yeah.
KELLY: ...But I will share. You submitted your own letter.
ANDERSON: Yeah.
KELLY: It's in the collection, anonymous.
ANDERSON: Yeah. Yep.
KELLY: Gillian Anderson, you are out there - as people are gathering, speaking as openly as it is possible to speak about sex, about female pleasure. I just mentioned, you walked the red carpet in a vagina dress. Why keep your own submission private?
ANDERSON: Oh, because every - I'm - this is not my book. This is the book of all the women who submitted letters. This is every woman's book. And I found it hard to write it. I was shocked by how challenging I found it to write even an anonymous letter, which made me even more impressed and proud of all the women who went through with writing it themselves. I don't know what the circumstances are in their lives and the degree to which they need to keep this stuff private because of where they live or what their society declares is correct for how women behave and think. And I don't know their relationships with their partners, or...
KELLY: Yeah.
ANDERSON: ...You know? But women submitted letters and were unbelievably honest and raw and brave and detailed. And I just I found it extraordinary, and I'm very moved.
KELLY: I do want to ask - many of these entries are just beautiful. They are tender. They are sweet. There are others that are darker, including more violent scenarios on which you had to think carefully - do I include this or not? Talk to me about the chapter titled, "The Captive."
ANDERSON: It's a delicate balance, I think, when putting these letters out for public consumption. It was, you know, clearly down to the women submitting as to what they felt comfortable sharing. We received letters that border on rape and multiple sex partners in a way that was slightly different than some of the other letters that were about group sex - that felt like they were a little more dangerous or, again, bordering on violence.
KELLY: And is the dilemma - is it about, on the one hand, people are allowed to fantasize about whatever they want...
ANDERSON: Well, yes.
KELLY: ...On the other hand, you don't...
ANDERSON: Yeah.
KELLY: ...Want to put anything in the world that legitimizes violence against women? Is that...
ANDERSON: It's that...
KELLY: ...What it boils down to?
ANDERSON: ...Yeah. Yeah, I think that's what it boils down to. But it also, you know - it exists. It is some people's truth in terms of their internal lives. And so we wanted to be able to represent as many voices and as many experiences as we received. There were some restrictions about illegality. I like the fact that we allow it but are mindful about what it is that we're putting out there.
KELLY: Yeah. Favorite chapter? Favorite heading for all of these?
ANDERSON: (Laughter) Good question. I don't know - maybe "Strangers."
KELLY: Which is kind of self-explanatory - that's sex with...
ANDERSON: Yeah.
KELLY: ...You don't know.
ANDERSON: Yeah. Yeah. So just even thinking about women on the commutes in the morning and fantasizing about, you know, scenarios they would wish to find themselves in...
KELLY: Yeah. 'Cause the women themselves are strangers - we don't know who they are.
ANDERSON: Yeah.
KELLY: Yeah. Gillian Anderson, actor and facilitator of the new book...
ANDERSON: Facilitator.
KELLY: ..."Want." This has been a total pleasure.
ANDERSON: Thank you so much.
(SOUNDBITE OF HOT CHOCOLATE SONG, "YOU SEXY THING") Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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