Governor Brian Sandoval opens up about partisanship in the internet age, his practical philosophy of governing, and how cleaning sheep pens can prepare you for a political career
Governor Brian Sandoval is a fan of history. And why not? He’s made a fair bit of it himself.
He was Nevada’s first Hispanic statewide elected official when he won the race for attorney general in 2002. He was the first Hispanic governor when he was elected in 2010. And he was the first person in state history to defeat an incumbent of his own party in a primary when he ousted then-Gov. Jim Gibbons.
He was also the first Republican governor to decide — after the U.S. Supreme Court upheld the constitutionality of the Affordable Care Act — to expand Medicaid in Nevada and establish a state-based health insurance exchange. His support of the program was a factor as national Republicans debated an ultimately unsuccessful effort to dismantle it. And he was the governor who oversaw the implementation of the first tax on business revenue in state history in the unlikely crucible of a Republican-dominated state Legislature in 2015.
The young man who once eagerly researched reports about U.S. presidents has since had the chance to lead as a chief executive himself. And while there are critics, many stipulate Sandoval will be remembered as one of the best governors the state has had, the right man at the right time with the right temperament to lay the foundation of what the governor relentlessly calls the New Nevada.
With just 16 months to go in his second and final term, Desert Companion sat down with the governor in his Carson City office to discuss politics, policy and his legacy. This interview has been edited for length and clarity.
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Let’s start at the beginning. You’re a federal judge, you’re on the bench. Some friends come to you and say, “You know what, you ought to run for governor.” Had you thought about it before that?
Seriously run for governor? Yes. I was loving my experience on the bench. I was coming into my own. I’d been on the bench for almost four years. I had had the privilege of serving as a visiting judge on the Ninth Circuit three times. I had had between 15 and 20 jury trials and was, in my opinion, doing well.
Was it a difficult decision to give that up? That’s a lifetime job that so many people who are lawyers would die for and would cling to.
It was the most difficult professional decision that I had ever had to make. You’re right, it is a lifetime appointment, I had been recommended by our senators, I had been nominated by President Bush, I had been confirmed unanimously by the U.S. Senate. As I said, I think I was doing well as a federal judge, but at the same time, the state was in its worst economic situation that it had ever been in in its history. I mean, it was a very personal decision, one that, frankly, I wasn’t going to do it, I was going to stay on the bench, and, after a conversation with my wife, we decided to go to dinner, and she said to me, “Brian, if you don’t do this, you’ll be driving to that courthouse every day for the rest of your life thinking you could have made a difference.”
You mentioned the state of the state and how that kind of weighed into your thinking. Was that something you’d been thinking about for a while as you went about your daily life?
Well, yeah, as a judge, I’m handling my docket, but at the same time, you read the paper. You know what’s going on. And I’m a proud Nevadan, I love my state, it’s given me everything that I have. And it really hurt me to see the situation that we were in. And as part of that calculus of me making that decision — you know, I had served in the Legislature, I had served on the Gaming Commission, I’d served as the attorney general, I’d served as a member of the TRPA (the Tahoe Regional Planning Agency) — I felt like I had a good strong book of experience to perhaps make a difference.
What would you have done if you’d lost that race?
Probably be practicing law. Because that’s the thing, a lot of people think I could have gone back to the bench. I mean, you step away from a federal judgeship, it’s over. And the only way to get back is to get recommended, to get nominated and to get confirmed. So it was leaving a very good position, and, as you said, a position that is the pinnacle of an attorney’s career. And that’s the thing, Kathleen said, “We’ll be OK.” I mean, I like to tell people I actually was a pretty good lawyer in my own right. But I would have gone back to practicing law and rebuilding things.
When you ran in 2010, you ran on a fairly conservative platform. As I recall, every candidate did. Was that a function of the times that you were in, the recession and things of that nature, or was it because you were running against Jim Gibbons and you didn’t want to give him any quarter as somebody who might raise taxes at some point?
I would say it was primarily a function of the times that we were in. We’ve talked about this, we had 14-plus percent unemployment, there was an unemployment deficit of between $500 million and $1 billion at the time, people were struggling, small businesses were struggling, the economy was struggling. It was the worst time to consider a tax increase.
I talked to a few people before I came up to see you today, and they all used the same adjectives — pragmatic, practical, moderate, judicial in terms of temperament, that’s the Brian Sandoval that Nevada knows today. Talk about that transition, from saying, “We can’t have any new taxes” to “Okay, now we have a problem, and we have to do this.”
Well, one of my thoughts is that there is a difference between campaigning and governing. And another thing you have to recognize is that when I came in, we had a $2 billion budget deficit. I’m sure you’re alluding to the sunset taxes; those are something that had been built into the budget, and we had already had to make some pretty devastating cuts to get the budget to balance with regard to K-12 and higher ed. You’re also familiar with the Clean Water Coalition decision that essentially said that the way that we had built the budget wasn’t going to work. And this was with three weeks to go in the (2011) legislative session? And so, I made the decision to go ahead and continue the sunsets for that first budget in 2011.
The Long View
Gov. Sandoval at his office in Carson City. "There are members of my party who frankly don't agree with my methods," he says. "But I have to do what I think is in the best interests of the state."
There are some politicians who would not have done that. They would have said, “I ran on this campaign pledge, and that’s the most important thing.” One of the people I talked to said, “Look, what makes this important and significant is he did not have to do that. He could have continued to cut.”
No, there’s no doubt. As I said, I love my state. And when you sit in a kindergarten classroom or visit a middle school or go to a high school, visit the universities and talk to those students, and look them in the eye and talk to teachers and see that we can do a lot better for them, and again, you have to do this in the context of diversifying the economy and bringing in the companies that we have, we have to have an education system to match. Absolutely, it was a difficult decision for me to do that, but I knew that it was the right decision for our state. As I thought about it more and more, it became very clear to me that there really was no other alternative that I felt was in the best interests of Nevada.
We had an education system, essentially, and a funding system that was 50 years old. And we have a student population that is completely different from that which we had 50 years ago. We have a lot more diversity, we have a lot more English language-learners, we have a lot more children in poverty, all things that in order to improve a graduation rate that was in the low 60s — and, by the way, is close to 80 percent now — we had to make those types of investments. Certainly we could putter along as we did before and kind of be stuck in less than mediocrity, or be a state like we are now, that’s leading the country in growth.
So, in 2014, the Democrats could not find someone to run against you. The candidate they finally found, Robert Goodman, was defeated by “None of These Candidates” in the primary. Did you take that as justification?
I’m not going to speculate. I hope that it was a show of confidence in the job I’ve done.
One statewide elected official I talked to described himself as a “Brian Sandoval Republican.” What is a Brian Sandoval Republican?
I think you said it before, it’s someone who’s pragmatic, somebody who does their homework, somebody who is a solutions person, somebody who cares deeply about people. For me, it’s looking people in the eye, and learning what their problems are, what their challenges are, and then coming back here, and this office is a gift, it is an incredible privilege and opportunity to be able to solve (problems) and help people. So that’s what I would say — pragmatic, solutions, a lot of empathy for people, and hard work. I also have to say I have an amazing staff. You have to have a strong team with you, it’s not just me, and I have a great cabinet and people who are willing to put in the hard work to make all these things happen. None of this happens in a vacuum.
I think I just heard the perfect description of the anti-Trump. I mean, someone who is self-effacing, crediting others, doesn’t take credit for saying, “I’m the greatest, the best that’s ever been.”
Well, I want people to be proud of their governor, I want the people to be proud of their state. And I want them to be able to wake up in the morning and have a job to go to, so that they can provide for their family, that they can drop their kids off at school and know that they’re going to get a proper education and that they will then go on to a respected higher education system, and when they graduate from there, on to a career. So that’s what I care about. I mean, it’s not about me. It just simply is not.
You’re known to appreciate history. Could you imagine that a young man growing up helping to raise sheep would someday be the attorney general of the state, and the governor of the state during its 150th birthday?
It never occurred to me. It never occurred to me growing up. And it’s true, I grew up in East Sparks, and we lived on five acres of land, we had a little flock of sheep, and my brother and I were responsible for them. Those sheep belonged to us. That’s how I paid for my first car, that’s how I paid my way through college. My job was to clean the sheep pens. And I always tell the joke, it was good practice for what I’m doing now. But in any event, it never occurred to me. I hoped, someday, that I would be in a position where I could help people and make a difference.
Did there come a time that you recall, after you’d been elected, when the weight and the responsibility of the job kind of became real to you?
My first year as governor was hard. It was hard in the sense there was the (Reno) air race disaster up here, there was a train crash in Fallon, there was the IHOP where the three National Guardsmen and National Guardswoman were brutally murdered. I think there were some fires — there was a fire, at least. There was the legislative session, and so, I was thrown into it right away. When you start to put all those together, you start to realize that there’s a massive responsibility that you have.
If you were, like some past presidents, to follow the tradition of leaving a letter for your successor in your desk, what would that letter say? What advice would you give to the next governor?
My advice would be to put your mouthpiece in, put your helmet on, bring your lunch pail to work every day because in order to do this job right, in my opinion, you have to work really hard. You have to be informed, you have to build a really strong cabinet and staff that you can rely upon, but at the same time you’ve got to laugh, you have to get out there, you have to visit the communities, you have to meet with people and get a good understanding of their day-to-day lives.
You are the first Hispanic governor of Nevada. Do you feel like you are a role model in that sense? Do you feel like you need to set a good example?
Well, I feel like I should set a good example for everybody. But it really is, from what people have told me, a source of pride within the Latin community. But I try to do the best I can do on a daily basis, and I want to make everybody proud. But I hope that it gives some hope to some young men and women in the Latino community that if you work hard — and I tell them this — that everybody should have a dream, it comes with a lot of hard work, but Nevada’s still a place where if you are willing to work hard, you can do whatever you want to do.
You’ve been elected to the Assembly, elected attorney general, now you’ve been elected governor twice. Do you enjoy politics?
I enjoy governing more. But in order to govern, you have to politick. I don’t know of anybody who enjoys raising money, but you know, that’s something that you have to do in order to run an effective campaign. I enjoy getting out and shaking hands and meeting with people and visiting schools and learning. The part I don’t enjoy is being away from my family. I guess when you mentioned about advice to the next governor, it is a big sacrifice for your family. My kids have been in the public eye since they were born.
Do you try to shield them from some of the more negative aspects of politics?
You can’t. And that’s the hard part. They hear it at school, and it’s hard for them. They’re proud of their dad, they love their dad, they know and they understand that I have to make decisions. That’s part of what I tell people as governor: If you’re pleasing everybody, you’re lying to somebody. And you have to make decisions that are going to make some people unhappy. As you know, social media is a big deal and this generation is very involved in social media, so they read it, they see it, they hear it. That’s one of the hard parts of politics. But as I said, you can’t shield them from that.
That’s got to be hard on everybody.
And my wife — I’m so proud of her, she is the first full-time working first lady in the history of this state. She has been almost personally responsible for the passage of juvenile justice legislation and the opioid legislation. She works with at-risk kids and families on a daily basis, so she’s balancing a family, she’s balancing a full-time job, and she’s balancing being first lady, all at the same time, so that’s hard. But those are some of the things that I don’t talk about, but you asked the question. For them, they want to have their own lives. They want to have their own identities, they don’t want to be the governor’s son or the governor’s daughter. They want to be their own person.
You are the titular head of the Republican Party in Nevada. And there are a lot of people in that party who criticize you. They call you the RINO, for Republican in Name Only. What’s your reaction?
I hear all that. I’m not deaf to that, I’m not blind to that. When you’re in politics long enough, you come to understand and appreciate and know there’s going to be a difference of opinion, even in your own party. But, as I said, at the end of the day, I have to do what I think is in the best interests of the state, and I think that, at least up until now — I don’t want to jinx anything — the state is better. I mean, we have improved economically, we have improved education, the state is in a much better position than it was six and a half years ago. There are members of my party who frankly don’t agree with my methods, and my challenge to them, for the ones who want to cut the taxes, is then they have to be honest about what they’re going to cut. Are you going to cut K-12 education? So, I understand the criticism, I appreciate the criticism, I respect the criticism. But I have to do what I think is in the best interests of the state.
Do you ever get the sense that you’re kind of talking past each other?
Well, it goes back to what we talked about before. There is a difference between campaigning and the ideology that you’ve discussed, and governing. And when you sit in my chair, you come to appreciate very quickly the needs of the state and how people are counting on you who aren’t just members of the Republican Party. I still believe, in light of everything we’ve talked about, that I’m conservative at heart. These guys know, my staff knows, that I’m pinching every possible penny. But at the same time, there are just some fundamental requirements and needs that you have to ensure for the state to move forward.
Lookback: March/April 2010: With Harry Reid up for re-election, Hugh Jackson ponders the implications for Nevada if he were to lose. Read that and more highlight political stories from our 10 years.
I’m not trying to get you to criticize the president, but with politics in the age of Trump, it’s a zero-sum, winner-take-all type game, where you have people who support one candidate because they hate the other candidate, and the viciousness that sometimes attends the debate in public. How do you govern in a space like that, in a time like that?
It is a different environment. Twenty-five years ago, it was a 24-hour news cycle, you’d book your story at 5 p.m., it would be in the paper the next morning, and it would be another 24 hours. And now, with Twitter, and blogs and the internet, it’s literally moment to moment. And the environment has definitely changed, and, as you said, some people applaud that type of approach with regard to politics in terms of demonizing your opponent. That’s an individual choice. That’s not an approach that I have ever taken. Certainly, criticism is fair game in politics, but I think you can take it too far.
Do you think the system is broken and that’s why we’re seeing what we’re seeing, or is this just a particular moment in history where these forces have kind of come together as the perfect storm and it will play itself out eventually?
I think it’s cyclical. I read a lot of history, and you’d be surprised about what things people said and did 100 years ago, 150 years ago. It was probably worse than now.
You mentioned that you’re a proud Republican. Was there ever a time when you said, “You know, I don’t know if I can stay a Republican?”
Never. Never. No, I’m proud of my party and, as we’ve talked about already, there are going to be people within the party who aren’t going to agree with you. But I’m as strong and proud a Republican as I’ve ever been. I think there is just as much divisiveness within the Democratic Party, but I will always be a proud Republican.
Let’s talk about some of your vetoes. You’ve had 93 vetoes over eight years, four legislative sessions. There is some partisanship involved. But is there a leadership issue in that as well?
You’re right, there is a big element of partisanship in that. And you have to understand in four sessions of the Legislature, I had Democratic majorities in three of those. And I get it, the Democratic leadership has a base, too, and they have to say that they tried. And that they got something passed and the governor vetoed the bill, so I think that’s most of it.
So some of it is for a political flier, and less for legislation?
I think, if I understand what you’re saying, the Democrats have to be able to show their base that they tried to pass a minimum- wage bill, a sick-leave bill and some of these other bills that I had to veto. There were conversations about these bills. But again, I understand and respect their position, and I hope they understand and respect the position I took.
It seems to me, if I was in the Legislature, and I had a bill that I thought might be controversial, I might come to you first and say, “Governor, here’s what I want to do. I want to have paid sick leave. I don’t know how you might feel about that. What kind of a bill could I write that you would support?” Do you get those kind of conversations?
Some. And I’ll give a perfect example of that, with Senator (Yvanna) Cancela and her bill for diabetes (drug prices). She came to me, I identified to her what my concerns with the bill were, there was a decision to pass that bill anyway. And I wrote a very detailed veto message, and to her credit, she read that veto message and she also went back and worked with Senator (Michael) Roberson. And she came back with a bill that I could sign.
In the last session, there were two solar energy bills you vetoed — one would have raised the renewable energy standard, and the other would have created a system for community solar programs. You have directed the energy choice committee to look at those and come back with a report. Was that sort of a punt?
No. No, no, no. You’re talking to the governor who signed three bills that increased the net metering rate. And then, at the same time, we have installed $5 billion to $6 billion of solar projects in this state since I became governor, which involves $300 million, $400 million in incentives through our energy office. So I’ve always felt, and I am, a very strong supporter of renewable energy.
Some if somebody were to say these vetoes evidence a lack of commitment to renewable energy, that would be wrong?
True. You also have to understand the ballot question with regard to energy choice, which will go back on the ballot next year. If it’s approved, essentially, buying energy will be like buying cable or your phone — you’ll be able to pick your energy provider. But that question also requires the incumbent utility here, NV Energy, to exit. And they will have, when they exit, assets that have to be sold, and if they’re sold at a deficit, it’s the ratepayers who have to make that up. Well, if you increase that renewable portfolio standard, it likely would require the construction of new renewable energy projects by the incumbent utility, which it would have to turn around and sell if the Energy Choice initiative passes — which it will, because it passed by 70 percent (in 2016). This is probably one of the most tumultuous times ever in energy policy with the prospect of energy choice. And to overlay that with a 50 percent renewable portfolio standard would have been, in my humble opinion, very problematic. So that was one of the biggest issues in my veto message, and it was probably the longest veto message in the history of Nevada. That was eight pages.
And you personally wrote that veto message?
I did. I did. It’s not because I don’t support a robust renewable portfolio standard, because I think that Nevada is going to be the leader in the country with regard to renewable energy given our solar assets, and our geothermal assets, and our wind assets and the rooftop solar, et cetera. But the timing wasn’t right. It was probably the right bill at the wrong time. And that’s why I appointed that commission to study the consequences and what we have to anticipate as a result of energy choice.
Do you think the public, when we’re talking about renewable energy, gives the renewable energy industry a pass? NV Energy is supposedly the evil utility, they’re the ones who send me the $300 bill every month in summer, but the green energy companies want to save the planet. Do they get a pass because people perceive them as the good guys versus NV Energy, the bad guys?
You’re right, it’s very easy as a green energy provider to cloak yourself in all the good things; I think there has been an acknowledgement that there has been a subsidy that goes in, that the other 90 percent do pay a higher rate to allow for more rooftop solar. I understand that. I think the day will come that rooftop solar and solar is absolutely economical and is the same if not cheaper than some of the fossil fuels and natural gas, et cetera. But we need to build toward that, and that’s why that (net metering) bill was designed the way it is, is that there are more installations, the reimbursements on the retail rate are going to come down to recognize that.
There are people to this day who say, “Brian Sandoval never really supported Education Savings Accounts. If he had supported ESAs, he would have threatened to veto the 2017-2019 budget, which did not contain ESA funding.” What’s the truth about that?
Well, I sponsored ESA bills. In 2013, I sponsored an ESA bill that got a hearing and no vote. So school choice is something that I’ve talked about from Day One. In 2015, the school choice bill was passed, and it was the subject of litigation. It went all the way to the Nevada Supreme Court. And so I made a commitment and followed through with that commitment and put $60 million in the budget to fund ESAs. So if ever there was a supporter of school choice, if you count the top five, I would hope that I would be in those top five.
Now you mentioned about trying to force that issue. And as I said, I’ve got a state to run. There are teachers who need to get paid, there are school districts that need to be able to develop their budgets, there’s higher education that needs to develop their budget, there are a lot of people who are counting on stability within the state. And so, frankly, during the course of the session, I think there was a time when we would have had ESAs, and it didn’t happen because there were some within the Republican Party who felt like it wasn’t enough and wanted more. So I will say that we could have had ESAs. It didn’t happen. But at the end of the session, I was able to negotiate $20 million more for Opportunity Scholarships, which is going to open up at least a couple thousand more seats for children who are 300 percent or less of poverty to be able to attend the school of their choice.
One of your campaign promises when you ran — it was a recession — was to put Nevada back to work. Unemployment has dropped considerably since you took over. Do you consider that a campaign promise fulfilled?
I don’t know if it’s ever fulfilled, because I’m not done yet. So, when I was elected in November of 2010, the unemployment rate was 14.3 percent, and today it’s 4.7. We had lost 175,000 jobs, we’ve replaced that with 230,000 jobs, our average weekly wage is the highest that it has ever been, the amount of unemployment claims is almost the lowest that it’s ever been. And we brought in companies; Tesla is the one that everybody knows. You know I tell this story as the chairman of the economic development board: Our first board meeting took 20 minutes. And now they take hours because of the number of the companies that want to come to Nevada.
There are always risks, though. The state was not put at financial risk because of Faraday Future not coming, but the state takes a hit when things like that happen, doesn’t it? Everybody thought it was going to happen, but in the end, it just didn’t work out.
Fair enough. I mean, there is nobody who is more disappointed than I am in Faraday. Faraday got all the attention, but for me, the bigger priority was developing Apex. And one of the reasons that we couldn’t bring a Tesla-like project to Southern Nevada is because there was no infrastructure at Apex. So, for me, just as important — actually, more important than Faraday — was getting that infrastructure into Apex so that we could attract and market Southern Nevada for a Tesla-scale project. And I’m hopeful that the Faraday site will be very attractive to other companies, because it’s ready to go, and they’ll be able to go vertical right away.
This question is going to sound like it’s not serious, but it is a little bit serious. You were the first governor to ride in a driverless car, you’ve championed bringing companies like Apple and Tesla to Northern Nevada, UAV research to Southern Nevada, Switch to both ends of the state. Tesla founder Elon Musk recently came out and said that he thinks that artificial intelligence is a threat to people. What was your reaction to that?
I’m the incoming chairman of the National Governor’s Association. As part of that, I have an initiative called “Ahead of the Curve.” And it talks about some of this disruptive technology and how it’s going to affect decision-makers and state governments. Elon agreed to come to Providence, R.I., and we did a comfy couch-type interview where I asked him questions, and I asked him a question about robots, and should people be concerned about ‑robots taking their jobs? And that’s when he gave that response with regard to artificial intelligence. I am nowhere near qualified to be able to respond to that, but if he’s concerned and given what a visionary and how knowledgeable he is, then it’s something that we should perhaps pay attention to.
You’ll probably be remembered not only for embracing the Affordable Care Act, after it was upheld by the Supreme Court, but for expanding Medicaid, establishing a state insurance exchange and then defending those programs when other people said we need to get rid of them. Is that going to be your legacy?
People hopefully have not forgotten that there was a time when UMC was $50 million to $100 million in the red. I visited the emergency room at UMC, and saw people literally lying on gurneys in the hallways. I am one that, with Mike Willden, my chief of staff, confronted a mental healthcare crisis. So part of my motivation for opting in was making sure that people who were getting their medical care in emergency rooms could get preventative health care and live higher-quality lives. (Medicaid expansion) has brought billions of dollars into the state in terms of improving our healthcare systems; it has taken rural hospitals and UMC from being in the red to being in the black. So I’ve seen the difference that it’s made in our state and how it’s improved the quality of life. People are living healthier and happier lives. It’s pretty hard to go to work when you’re sick. And that’s why I took a very firm position that we had to be held harmless. I don’t want the flexibility to have to make cuts. That’s not flexibility to me. I want to maintain what we’ve been able to establish and build in this state, and I think the proof is there, that we are better off as a result of that.
Was that a hard decision to make, at the time?
It was. And we did a lot of homework prior to making that decision. And although some members of my party were disappointed in me being the first Republican governor in the U.S. to make the decision to opt in, after having done my due diligence, it was a decision that had to be made in the best interests of the state. And so, again, everything that we thought would happen has happened in terms of improving the delivery of healthcare in the state. Is it perfect? Absolutely not. Am I happy with what’s happening on the exchange, our providers leaving the state? Absolutely not. Am I happy with the premiums that are being charged for people? Absolutely not. But those are things that we could work on and improve. But in terms of the Medicaid population, it has been a game-changer, so that’s why I’ve been so aggressive in jealously guarding the people of Nevada.
Looking back, is there something that you wished you would have gotten done but didn’t get done?
I would have liked to have gotten ESAs done. I think it’s an important component within the education system, to give parents and give kids the ability to attend the school of their choice. But these past two sessions, there was only one item on our checklist that I talked about in the State of the State that we didn’t get done, and that was ESAs. So, every single thing that I talked about we got done. In the 2015 session, if my recollection is right, the only thing that we couldn’t get done was appointed school boards. But other than that, I’ve been very blessed, and we’ve been able to improve education, we’ve been able to get higher education back on track, build a medical school at UNLV, we’ve been able to build a new hotel and hospitality school at UNLV, we’re going to build a new engineering school at UNR, we’re going to build a new healthcare facility at CSN, we’re going to be able to build a new building at Nevada State College, so all of it is coming together.
Is there an accomplishment that you think has not gotten the recognition that it should have gotten?
I’m not looking for any credit. What I care about is that the state’s doing better. And so that’s a question that would be better answered after I’m gone. And people will hopefully look back and see that the education system is better, that we’ve diversified our economy, that we’ve righted the ship. I mean, when I came in, we had a $2 billion deficit; now we’re putting $200 million in our rainy day fund. And we’re building a new state park. We’re finally in a position — I’ve kiddingly said the next governor gets to be conservative, because I have made some really hard decisions that have hopefully put this state in a position where it is set for the next 10, 20 years, in terms of higher education, K-12 education, the economy, the budget, the types of companies that are here.
What about you? What are you going to do? Would you ever run for president?
I don’t know what is next for me. I’m getting asked that a lot recently. I guess the point being, I still have 17 more months as governor. And we’re not coasting to the finish line. We’re not going to coast through the tape. And I want to make sure some of the things, or most of the things, that we’ve talked about during this conversation get implemented. So, a year from now, I better start having an idea, so I think your question is a little premature in terms of what’s next for me. You know, I’m not a wealthy man. I’ve got to work; I’ve got to be able to provide for my family. I have two kids in college and a daughter who’s in eighth grade, so I’ve got to make a living. And so I’ll probably start to think about that next spring, the beginning of next summer, about what’s next.
If you could have any job you wanted, what would it be?
It would be a job where I feel like I’m helping people and making a difference. As I said, I’ve been blessed with having a job where I can do that on a daily basis as governor, and as a federal judge as well, so that’s going to be hard to beat. But wherever it is, I just have to feel like I’m making people’s lives better.